Recently I posted a request for upgrading the base css generated by Orchard but it was closed
http://orchard.codeplex.com/workitem/19438


My request was motivated by the great difficulty to adapt Orchard internaly generated css to something more up to date and generic as boostrap.
The css classes in Orchard are 'repeatitive' (many class need the same css code: zones, content, content-record, display-content, content-item, etc.) and missing some structuration (no clear separation of displayed elements as we could find in row, container, row-fluid, span for example, because no clear content identified)

Bootstrap is a growing standard and well structured, I am interested to know its adoption inside Orchard community.

What I don't understand is why you don't build your themes by starting from one of the existing Bootstrap themes, if that's what you like? Why would it have to be the default? Bootstrap comes with a lot of baggage that we don't need on a default theme, and also with its own idiosyncrasies. Some, for example, find the markup that you have to build for it to work to be non-semantic and too div-rich.

Bertrand, I know that your role is to avoid unecessary questioning about Orchard.
You are amongst the few founders of Orchard and this give you vision, credibility and authority, I voted for you for comittee.
Your answer covers various aspects:
1) my own work
2) my question

Concerning my question, I simply asked who is using Orchard, kind of status of theming practice in Orchard.
Next point in this question is the actual structure of Orchard css rule, or should I say non structure or inadapted structure.

Concerning taking Bootstrap as a standard, I agree with you, this could be a 'limiting' decision, this has to be evaluated, but, look, I remember the time people were asking should we adopt jquery...
And to evaluate a Library or component, the level of adoption is a key point.

Concerning 1), this is not the subject of my thread, we could change it...

My first move was to use an existing bootstrap orchard theme (orchard bootstrap, good work) but after 1 week on it I realized that 80% of the 'internal' views has to be replicated in the theme and rewritten to work, then that 50 of Orchard features were not working, with these patches, and need further rewritting.
Further the BS theme I was implementing internal code for layouts, I decided to migrate and adapt this in a dedicated module, then I created more code and each time realizing, when imbricating my code with traditionnal Orchard features as projections, rules, widgets, layout, that the Orchard css generated was not very adapted to a global integration: many classes are targetting only local module, different approach of css areas management are adopted in each module.
This is a constat for the internal shapes and templates from Core or Framework, from Orchard.xxx modules and each author of a module creates it own logic....

This is normal the documentation gives very few guidelines for css, kind of respective anarchy.


My idea is more could we envisage a lifting on css concept for 1.7 or 1.7 following version.

I also want to hear what others have to say about this, and I certainly didn't mean to shut down voices that I don't agree with. I don't see my role at all as avoiding unnecessary questioning about Orchard. Questioning is good.

So it seems like

A. you don't like the current default theme's css
B. you don't like the existing Bootstrap themes

There is certainly work that could and should be done for A to modernize the default theme.

As for B, I would suggest publishing your own version, as it is likely to help others as well.

But please, by all means, tell us what you think. I don't want to monopolize this discussion.

I am using it. And i had to rewrite the theme, obviously based on the bootstrap theme. It is not so complicated! what i have not figured out for example is how to change the Content zone, and how to render a sideleft menu. I think i will open a new thread for this. For basic purposes i have not had so much trouble!

Thanks, I've been using widgets for this but difficulties are in the 'non compatibles' layers of css blocks. On the end you often arrive to a superposition on the orchard native and the bootstrap one you added in your content. sometime they are interleaved and braeking each other.
Expecting some other testimonies here.

We're using the boostrap theme as a parent theme. Using bootstrap as the default theme might mean it is better supported with, for instance, shape tracing. Also, not sure if this is something to necessarily go by, but bootstrap is by far the most starred github repository (at 44,965 stars is greater than two times the next highest) so having it associated with Orchard in a higher profile way might make Orchard more appealing to other developers (who knows). Modifying the tags to be more semantic is no problem either. Often the layout file would be modified in a project anyway. I've been happy with the current bootstrap theme, though, so no worries if this doesn't happen.

Yes impressive